confusion over german inheritance

[sam]

My wife's mum has been estranged from her family for a long time, and her mum (i.e. my wife's grandmother) recently died leaving roughly equal amounts to her two daughters (contents of one named bank accounts each), and smaller amounts to her two grandaughters (my wife and her cousin).

Due to the estrangement, my wife's mum has refused her inheritance ('Erbausschlagung'). The court provided a note about this to all those inheriting in which it said that if the inheritance is refused, it goes to your children - i.e. my wife.

However, my wife's aunt (i.e. the other daughter) has written asking how we would like to divide up that money. It may be further complicated as the aunt had a power of attorney and possibly joint names on the bank account.

Everyone is in Germany apart from us, in the UK. Where do you think we would best go for some advice on this? German language is fine.

[Sannerl]

Due to the estrangement, my wife's mum has refused her inheritance ('Erbausschlagung'). The court provided a note about this to all those inheriting in which it said that if the inheritance is refused, it goes to your children - i.e. my wife.

However, my wife's aunt (i.e. the other daughter) has written asking how we would like to divide up that money. It may be further complicated as the aunt had a power of attorney and possibly joint names on the bank account.

Everyone is in Germany apart from us, in the UK. Where do you think we would best go for some advice on this? German language is fine.

As the court already told you.
https://www.verbraucherzentrale.de/wiss ... ssen-32411

Your wife shouldn't give her aunt anything, especially in writing!
The aunt and her daughter get exactly what they would if your MiL hadn't refused the inheritance.

If the aunt had legal power over the money in the bank account she wouldn't have asked IMHO...

[sam]

Now that is cynical! There is a will and it says that anything that is not set out in the will gets divided four ways. Being charitable, the aunt may be thinking that the gift goes back into the rest of the estate to be divided up when it is refused - but that is not what the court has said.

The thing here isn't just the money - my wife is obviously massively upset that her mum hasn't spoken to any of them for years, and really doesn't want to fall out with the rest of the family.

[Sannerl]

Now that is cynical! There is a will and it says that anything that is not set out in the will gets divided four ways. Being charitable, the aunt may be thinking that the gift goes back into the rest of the estate to be divided up when it is refused - but that is not what the court has said.

The thing here isn't just the money - my wife is obviously massively upset that her mum hasn't spoken to any of them for years, and really doesn't want to fall out with the rest of the family.

No it isn't.
If the aunt truthfully thinks that the "gift" goes back into the rest of the estate she's just a lousy lawyer.
You told us that the aunt may have the upper hand because she's a lawyer and may have access to the money inherited.
Her behavior seems suspicious to me - my late brother was a lawyer. Oh boy.
I just ask you to be vigilant.

[GaryC]

Being estranged and/or having power of attorney has nothing to do with anything and I would suggest following the court's ruling and not giving an inch in terms of finalising the estate. Anything else would seem like opening an unpleasant can or worms!

If your wife then decides to gift her aunt something from her inheritance, out of the kindness of her heart, that is a completely different issue.

[sam]

Thanks all but one thing, the aunt isn't a lawyer. I don't know where that came from. Don't think it changes the advice though!

[GaryC]

The aunt's occupation is irrelevant.

[snowingagain]

I am befuddled as to why the aunt would think this unfair. Let alone the sister's daughter. Her mother is basically just passing on her inheritance early. Of course if it is loads and goes on the (generous) tax free allowance the tax is higher for a grandchild.

[Sannerl]

Thanks all but one thing, the aunt isn't a lawyer. I don't know where that came from. Don't think it changes the advice though!

My fault. English isn't my first language.

[pappnase]

Thanks all but one thing, the aunt isn't a lawyer. I don't know where that came from. Don't think it changes the advice though!

My fault. English isn't my first language.

@Sannerl Attorney = legal-representative/lawyer. but Power-Of-Attorney = Vollmacht,

[kiplette]

Oh well spotted pappnase.

If granny/great granny is dead already, the power of attorney died with her. I had my Dad's and he was suddenly trying to get me to do stuff in his last weeks and after he died and I realised he hadn't made himself a new will, it became clear why he'd been so urgent about it all

[snowingagain]

I was wondering if the OP was mixing up POA and executor. Possible of cause that Aunty has the latter? Not that it gives her any power.

[Sannerl]

Oh well spotted pappnase.

If granny/great granny is dead already, the power of attorney died with her. I had my Dad's and he was suddenly trying to get me to do stuff in his last weeks and after he died and I realised he hadn't made himself a new will, it became clear why he'd been so urgent about it all

Not necessarily; there's also "Vollmacht über den Tod hinaus" which makes sense for couples especially but is not restricted to them.

Whatsoever: The aunt has to keep track of any withdrawals from her mother's account because the credit institutes will provide a list of the status quo on the day of her death. Hopefully.

[sam]

there's also "Vollmacht über den Tod hinaus" which makes sense for couples especially but is not restricted to them.

Yes the aunt has this for Oma's estate, but my wife thinks she has also been made "zweite Kontoinhaber" for the account which was destined for my wife's mum.

[Sannerl]

there's also "Vollmacht über den Tod hinaus" which makes sense for couples especially but is not restricted to them.

Yes the aunt has this for Oma's estate, but my wife thinks she has also been made "zweite Kontoinhaber" for the account which was destined for my wife's mum.

The aunt has no right to access that money - that would be embezzlement which is a felony.

[Fraufruit]

However, my wife's aunt (i.e. the other daughter) has written asking how we would like to divide up that money.

.....my wife thinks she has also been made "zweite Kontoinhaber" for the account

So has your wife replied yet? She can also ask about zweite Kontoinhaber when she does.

[sam]

Some slight painful steps to an agreement which looks like it'll be ok. Practical question. The family are saying an agreement should be with signed with a notarialische Beglaubigung. Our lawyer says that's not strictly necessary as there's no land.

If we're able to get them to sign a simple contract I'm assuming that doesn't mean my wife has to fly over? If it has to be a Beglaubigung is that everyone in the same room or would it be possible to do separately? (Maybe we can find a German Notar in the UK?)

[Robinson100]

I would strongly suggest not signing anything without first taking legal advice.
This might cost a bit, but at the end of the day, it could save you/your wife thousands!