I don't want to qualify for a German pension...

[Alberto]

Not fully on topic, but...
...what would happen if the same entity (UK, or DRV, or whatever), must pay the pension, AND the health care cost (public, or private, whatever) is higher than the actual pension? After all a pension can be very low, for example if a person has worked only a very short time, or the only pension they have is the one "inherited" from a deceased spouse...
Thanks,

[LeonG]

Not fully on topic, but...
...what would happen if the same entity (UK, or DRV, or whatever), must pay the pension, AND the health care cost (public, or private, whatever) is higher than the actual pension? After all a pension can be very low, for example if a person has worked only a very short time, or the only pension they have is the one "inherited" from a deceased spouse...
Thanks,

I don't think it matters. If you live in your home country getting a very small pension, they would have to pay for your health care, your small pension and maybe a top up of some social to keep you fed. If you move, they pay for your health care in some other country, your small pension and probably no top up since you moved.

What I know of people having retired to Spain for example, they apply for a form called S1 in their home country. After they've arrived in Spain and registered there, they sign up for healthcare using the S1 form. After that, they have access to health care but paid for by their home country.

Here is some info on the S1 for UK citizens: https://www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/health ... ealthcare/

Although I think in order to get an S1 from the UK, you would have to have NHS coverage.

[kiplette]

Well, the people in the UK know that I live in Germany as they send me the request for payment every year around this time. I got the latest request about a week or two ago.

Lots of people live here without building up a pension. So that isn't a thing.

And if on that form you have to put that you were in Germany and they find your 16 months themselves, maybe that would be aggregated into your UK pension rather. If it takes 60 months to grow a German one, 16 months can't trigger one, can it?

[Alberto]

I don't think it matters. If you live in your home country getting a very small pension, they would have to pay for your health care, your small pension and maybe a top up of some social to keep you fed. If you move, they pay for your health care in some other country, your small pension and probably no top up since you moved.

What I know of people having retired to Spain for example, they apply for a form called S1 in their home country. After they've arrived in Spain and registered there, they sign up for healthcare using the S1 form. After that, they have access to health care but paid for by their home country.

Here is some info on the S1 for UK citizens: https://www.nhs.uk/using-the-nhs/health ... ealthcare/

Although I think in order to get an S1 from the UK, you would have to have NHS coverage.

Say you're in Germany with a German pension, and KK costs of 300 eur/month.
If your pension is 2000 eur/month, they deduct from it the 300eur/month of KK and pay you the rest 1700eur/month.
But if your pension is 200 eur/month, do they still pay your full KK 300 eur/month?
Maybe it is indeed so, but I find it a little strange that "because you're poor" they end up paying you more than you became entitled to....

[kiplette]

confused message - ignore

[Prosie]

Well, the people in the UK know that I live in Germany as they send me the request for payment every year around this time. I got the latest request about a week or two ago.

Lots of people live here without building up a pension. So that isn't a thing.

And if on that form you have to put that you were in Germany and they find your 16 months themselves, maybe that would be aggregated into your UK pension rather. If it takes 60 months to grow a German one, 16 months can't trigger one, can it?

My concern would be that the UK contributions could equally be aggregated into the German system to create a German pension. DWP might feel incentivised to push for that once you apply for your S1. Perhaps especially so if - as in my case - you also have German citizenship.

[LeonG]

Say you're in Germany with a German pension, and KK costs of 300 eur/month.
If your pension is 2000 eur/month, they deduct from it the 300eur/month of KK and pay you the rest 1700eur/month.
But if your pension is 200 eur/month, do they still pay your full KK 300 eur/month?
Maybe it is indeed so, but I find it a little strange that "because you're poor" they end up paying you more than you became entitled to....

If you live in Germany with a German pension, you don't get an S1 but guaranteed if your pension is only 200€ per month, you can apply for social help and if you think it's strange that the 2000€ guy can't get social help too, I don't know what to tell you.

[PandaMunich]

My concern would be that the UK contributions could equally be aggregated into the German system to create a German pension. DWP might feel incentivised to push for that once you apply for your S1. Perhaps especially so if - as in my case - you also have German citizenship.

Read my lips:
If you do not apply for a German pension by filling in, signing and sending a Rentenantrag by snail mail to DRV (Deutschen Rentenversicherung), you will not get a German public pension.

Nobody can "push" you to file a Rentenantrag.
And your citizenship is of the supremest indifference.

[GaryC]

But if you call or use the code online to claim your pension that is not a question. They may then send you a form CF901 to complete to enable DWP to start the claim process for you in Germany or wherever but if you don't send that form back then they won't chase you for it.

[Prosie]

I know it is the case in reverse, that is if you apply in Germany, DRV will automatically apply for you in other countries you have contributed in.

Only if you tell them about these contributions in the other countries...

In my experience the application process in the UK requires you to tell them -- or at least to give them all the information to enable them to find out, should they feel so inclined.

[kiplette]

But if you call or use the code online to claim your pension that is not a question. They may then send you a form CF901 to complete to enable DWP to start the claim process for you in Germany or wherever but if you don't send that form back then they won't chase you for it.

Brilliant. So if Nina does it online, she's sorted. Thank you! We will be in a similar place in a few years.

[nina_glyndwr]

Well, the people in the UK know that I live in Germany as they send me the request for payment every year around this time. I got the latest request about a week or two ago.

Lots of people live here without building up a pension. So that isn't a thing.

And if on that form you have to put that you were in Germany and they find your 16 months themselves, maybe that would be aggregated into your UK pension rather. If it takes 60 months to grow a German one, 16 months can't trigger one, can it?

I talked to the Rentenversicherung and they said that, since I had paid into the pension system of another EU country (which the UK was until recently), I could have a pro rata German pension for those 16 months. Which is what I do not want to receive as it will mean that the UK won't take over my health insurance costs.

I know that there are other freelance translators who cannot afford to stop working - even in their 70s - as their health insurance is 600 or 700 euros a month. I don't want to use up my savings for that.

[Tap]

Hi Nina,
You’re certainly not alone with this, there are hundreds of us in a similar situation. Back when I started teaching freelance, the advice was to avoid paying into the German pension system, to get a “Befreiung”, which many of us did, I now believe that was a mistake.

My pension will just about cover my private health insurance costs. Luckily, I really like my job and I will continue working until my apartment is paid for, which is a few more years. After that, I really don't know what's ahead.

I hope you find a solution to your situation.

[kiplette]

I talked to the Rentenversicherung

I think the general position is do not ever contact the Rentenversicherung for any reason.

My other half worked for Citipost for a year and then stopped - he has never replied to any of the mail DRV have sent - we just put the envelopes in a drawer and ignore them.

My expectation is that when he reaches 67, he will apply for his OAP from the UK, by phone or using the online code as Gary has mentioned, in order to avoid awkward questions about German pension contributions.

Then he will be able to phone the nice people up at the S1 Stelle in Newcastle or wherever they are, and organise himself a lovely S1 and we'll be over 800€ a month better off.

He will of course be 'wasting' his Beiträge from that year of Citipost, but frankly whatevvah.

I imagine if you have been chatting to them a lot you can still reset it by not contacting them again, waiting until the magic age in the UK, and doing what we plan to do. If they send you post, burn it, if you think you might be sucked into contacting them again.

I cannot think there could be any possible negative outcome from breaking off all contact with them.