Is a monthly pension cut in half if a non citizen leaves Germany?

[Nixon]

Hello,

I have seen some questions regarding pension on the forum so these came up:

- Would a US citizen (with German Permanent Residency in Germany) lose a half of his or hers pension monthly payouts if the person leaves Germany/loses residency? This is the case where the person has worked in Germany for longer than 5 years.
- Would getting a citizenship and leaving after getting it prevent this outcome?
- What would happen with the pension if the US citizen moves to another EU country (Greece, Italy, Spain or Portugal)?
- I have seen there are Unbefristed cards for Germany and another type for the whole EU, would having the second one make some difference?

Thanks,

Nixon.

[PandaMunich]

No, don't worry, your German social security pension will not be cut, since it does not contain parts that are basically "gifts" of the German state to Spätaussiedler (= people from the German minority in various Eastern countries, whose descendants returned to Germany), whose pension is hiked based on their previous work in these Eastern countries.

Citizenship is irrelevant here.

Please read:

• https://www-hna-de.translate.goog/leben ... r_pto=wapp
• https://www-deutsche--rentenversicherun ... r_pto=wapp#
• https://www-deutsche--rentenversicherun ... r_pto=wapp

[Nixon]

Thank you Panda!

This is good to hear.
Of course, I will go to the RV office and sort out all of the paperwork.
Lived in several countries so it will take some time to take care of it.

[Nixon]

Ha, it looks like it was too late last night when I was posting the original question.
So I missed to ask about the part that the company puts into Rentersversicherung for me.

Company I work for puts into RV the same amount of money as I do (common in Germany ), so somebody told me that this part is not earned by me and that Government would not send it to me if I leave the country.

Yeah, crazy stuff going around.

[PandaMunich]

So I missed to ask about the part that the company puts into Rentersversicherung for me.

Company I work for puts into RV the same amount of money as I do (common in Germany ), so somebody told me that this part is not earned by me and that Government would not send it to me if I leave the country.

I think you were talking at cross-purposes with that "somebody".

He was talking about non-EU citizens who have worked for less than 5 years in Germany and who then move back home again.
They can apply after more than 24 months back home, to have DRV reimburse them what they had paid (= 9.3% * gross_salary is employee's half of 18.6% total) into German public pension insurance.
In this case, they will not get reimbursed what their employer paid in for them, which is another 9.3% * gross_salary.

See here on the website of the German embassy in Canada: https://canada.diplo.de/ca-en/consular- ... nd/1139232

• If you have paid mandatory contributions to the German pension fund for less than 5 years altogether and currently live outside of the EU, you may be able to have your pension contributions refunded.
  
  Non-EU citizens can apply for a refund if more than 24 months have passed since their last contribution.
  
  German citizens and citizens of another EU-country may be able to claim a refund after having reached the German retirement age.
  
  If you have paid contributions for 5 years or more, you will not be able to claim a refund. Instead, you will be able to apply for and receive a monthly pension upon reaching the German retirement age.
  
  In order to claim a refund, please fill out, sign and submit the following documentation to the German Pension Insurance:
  
  - Form “Antrag auf Beitragserstattung” (Application for a Pension Contribution Refund)
  
  - “Zahlungsermächtigung” (Declaration of Payment, Form A 1064)
  
  - “Certificate of Life and Citizenship” (Form A 9060 - certified by a Notary Public, a bank or a German Foreign Mission.
  
  (see links below)
  
  For white collar workers:
  Deutsche Rentenversicherung Bund
  10704 Berlin
  
  For blue collar workers:
  Deutsche Rentenversicherung Nord
  Friedrich-Ebert-Damm 245
  22159 Hamburg
  
  Declaration of Payment: https://canada.diplo.de/blob/1115652/3f ... d-data.pdf
  
  Antrag auf Beitragserstattung / Application for Pension Contribution Refund (in German and English language): https://deutsche-rentenversicherung.de/ ... eplication
  
  Certificate of Life and Citizenship (Form A9060): https://canada.diplo.de/blob/1107448/20 ... d-data.pdf

**********************************************************************************************************

But this does not apply to you, you had said in your initial post that you had contributed to German public pension insurance for at least 5 years
--> this is not an option that is open to you.

You will just get a life-long pension once you reach German retirement age, which will be based on both what you had paid in and on what your employer had paid in, no matter to which country you retire.

Though once you move away from Germany, you will have to check the double taxation agreement (DTA) between Germany and that country to see in which country you will have to tax your German social security pension.
Some DTAs assign the taxation right on a German social security pension to Germany, others to the new country of residence.

If it turns out that Germany has the taxation rights on your German social security pension, you can have the special Finanzamt that deals with all pensioners living outside Germany, the one in Neubrandenburg, calculate the due tax themselves and tell you how much you have to pay.
--> you will not have to file a German tax return in your old age: https://www.finanzamt-rente-im-ausland. ... rms-00001/

• It is possible to get the tax office to assess the tax on your behalf, without you having to submit a tax return.
  
  In general, pension recipients who are resident abroad are obliged to submit a tax return in Germany. Usually, however, the Neubrandenburg Tax Office waives the obligation to submit a tax return for pension recipients who are resident abroad, If you choose this option, the tax office will assess how much tax you need to pay using information from your pension provider. This procedure is known as the Amtsveranlagungsverfahren (“tax office assessment procedure”) in German.
  
  You can notify the Neubrandenburg Tax Office that you do not intend to submit a tax return using the following forms. You will then be sent a tax assessment notice (Steuerbescheid), which includes information about the amount of tax assessed and the payment deadline. If you want to be treated as a person subject to unlimited tax liability, you can use the response form to indicate this. Please also enclose either the form “EU/EEA Certificate” or “Non-EU/EEA Certificate”, as appropriate.
  
  Form for declaration of waiver of tax return
  Antwortformular englisch - Reply slip: https://www.finanzamt-rente-im-ausland. ... glisch.pdf

[Nixon]

Now I can go to my fridge and open a beer.

I don't have anything else to add, except that I should download this answer, print it and carry it in my wallet for the next 15-ish years when I should reach my retirement age. That way it can be quickly shown to couple of my friends

Thank you PAnda.