Way more text than needed to actually even ask my question but apparently I wanted to get some of this off my chest, so I'll park it here.
Many years ago (in December 2009), not too long after I moved to Germany I wanted to get a pension set up, used a financial advisor good friends recommended and set up a Riester-Rente at DWS. It was one of the best ones at the time, iirc. The recommendation for that financial advisor was not a good one, however, an I blindly trusted him when he suggested that I choose the option that meant the majority of fees (possibly only his commission) would be frontloaded to be paid over the first 5 years.
About three years after that, this came up during a discussion on TT and Starbright* tried to help me understand what I bad deal that was. I mean, I did learn in school how compound interest works but I just didn't really fully accept just what a difference it makes in the long run. At any rate, I decided since I was closer to the end of that 5 years than not, I'd just leave it and continue paying into it. And apart from reducing the amount I pay in every month (after I left my crappy job, I was unemployed for a few months, then moved to a much better but far less well-paying job in 2016), have mostly just ignored it.
So, more or less, I paid in 200 every month from 2009 until probably about 2015, then reduced it to 50, before upping it to 75 again a year or so later. And there it has been since then. Although according to the DRV calculator, my minimum amount to get the full Zulage should be 108. Around the time I moved for that job in 2016, I had been a member of the Mr. Money Mustache forums for a while and was finally starting to wrap my head around investing and compounding and all that and I had finally set up an account with ING and started a Sparplan for an ETF. The current value of my ING depot is now very close to that of my Riester, paying in max 100/month, for over 6 years less! Should've listened to Starbright and gotten out of that Riester contract in 2013 or whenever it was!!!
Because I am just a teeny bit chaotic when it comes to paperwork and organisation in general outside of work, I have basically just assumed that what I read at the time about the Zulagen and the tax advantages would be fine and it would all end up having been worth it when I'm old and grey. Since the end of 2015, I have also worked as a freelance translator (to make up a bit for the lower pay in my fulltime job) and at that stage I asked a colleague if he'd do my taxes for me. I had no idea how to find a Steuerberater that I could trust otherwise (he is a Rechtsanwalt and Steuerberater, I didn't just ask a random guy). Again, because of how chaotic things become around me, I have just sent him off piles of paper and information every year, he does the return, and I get a Bescheid telling me how much to pay. Except for one glorious year where I had high enough expenses to get a refund.
All this to say, I don't actually have copies of my tax returns to be able to check them for any information anyone might need. After my recent terrible horrible no good very bad 2+ year stint of severe depression, I am currently struggling to get everything together for my 2022, 2023 and 2024 returns. Hopefully, I won't have to pay any more fines than I already have.
* I'm pretty sure it was Starbright. Wasn't he an insurance guy? I cannot for the life of me remember his real name.
About three years after that, this came up during a discussion on TT and Starbright* tried to help me understand what I bad deal that was. I mean, I did learn in school how compound interest works but I just didn't really fully accept just what a difference it makes in the long run. At any rate, I decided since I was closer to the end of that 5 years than not, I'd just leave it and continue paying into it. And apart from reducing the amount I pay in every month (after I left my crappy job, I was unemployed for a few months, then moved to a much better but far less well-paying job in 2016), have mostly just ignored it.
So, more or less, I paid in 200 every month from 2009 until probably about 2015, then reduced it to 50, before upping it to 75 again a year or so later. And there it has been since then. Although according to the DRV calculator, my minimum amount to get the full Zulage should be 108. Around the time I moved for that job in 2016, I had been a member of the Mr. Money Mustache forums for a while and was finally starting to wrap my head around investing and compounding and all that and I had finally set up an account with ING and started a Sparplan for an ETF. The current value of my ING depot is now very close to that of my Riester, paying in max 100/month, for over 6 years less! Should've listened to Starbright and gotten out of that Riester contract in 2013 or whenever it was!!!
Because I am just a teeny bit chaotic when it comes to paperwork and organisation in general outside of work, I have basically just assumed that what I read at the time about the Zulagen and the tax advantages would be fine and it would all end up having been worth it when I'm old and grey. Since the end of 2015, I have also worked as a freelance translator (to make up a bit for the lower pay in my fulltime job) and at that stage I asked a colleague if he'd do my taxes for me. I had no idea how to find a Steuerberater that I could trust otherwise (he is a Rechtsanwalt and Steuerberater, I didn't just ask a random guy). Again, because of how chaotic things become around me, I have just sent him off piles of paper and information every year, he does the return, and I get a Bescheid telling me how much to pay. Except for one glorious year where I had high enough expenses to get a refund.
All this to say, I don't actually have copies of my tax returns to be able to check them for any information anyone might need. After my recent terrible horrible no good very bad 2+ year stint of severe depression, I am currently struggling to get everything together for my 2022, 2023 and 2024 returns. Hopefully, I won't have to pay any more fines than I already have.
* I'm pretty sure it was Starbright. Wasn't he an insurance guy? I cannot for the life of me remember his real name.
I finally sorted out online access a while ago and was just looking at the summary for 2024. The admin costs are higher than the fecking Zulage, and I would never accept those kinds of costs if I were investing in, for example, an ETF.
Amount paid in in 2024 = +900,00
Grundzulage 2023 = +105,28
Abschluss- und Vertriebskosten = -5,27
Verwaltungskosten des Vertrages = -15,40
Verwaltungskoten der Investmentfonds = -110,87
Erwirtschaftete Erträge = + 49,98
This all leaves me with the total at the end of 2024 being just 923,72 more than the total at the end of 2023. Just 23,72 more than I paid in, less than a 3% return, which is abysmal. I do understand the stock market goes up and down and you have to be in it for the long haul but this definitely feels like a not terribly good investment. Although if I take the full amount I have paid in and the Garantieleistung zum Ende der Ansparphase, the return is closer to 10%, which isn't too bad.
I'm interested to know what other people would do or recommend?
- Increase the amount paid in every month to the minimum needed to get the full Zulage and trust that the next 17 years will be better than the last 15?
- Reduce the amount paid in every month down to a small amount (say 25, or 10?) just to keep it going? Or even down to nothing and just let it "ruhen"?
- Try and switch it to a different provider with lower costs, if such a thing exists? Honestly, I'm not sure I have the mental bandwidth to deal with all the paperwork and thinking that would involve, so it's not likely I'd do this.
